Author Topic: World Map Creation  (Read 9142 times)

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Offline Pokemon Steve

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #20 on: April 15, 2015, 08:25:24 pm »
It's hard to imagine any time where having the entire world in memory is necessary so I don't see the issue with a large world. Perhaps design the server to be scalable, spawn up additional servers and partition the world.

Offline Mongo

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #21 on: April 16, 2015, 08:57:56 am »
I don't have a lot to contribute to this. What I do want to say is I absolutely love a large scale world that is not easily traversable. Being able to go out and explore new places no one has been before, kill wolf and maybe make it back to your little shelter with your loot.. I dunno. I really enjoy it. When the world is small and every inch is inhabited by people, it's kinda boring. When the world is large and there's warpstones to instantly take you to every corner, that's also kinda boring.
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Offline Mickey Kudlo

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #22 on: May 06, 2015, 11:24:51 pm »
Got the client working with the server and showing the surface world and able to walk around using keyboard. Can now see what my new world creation code feels like on the player level. Turns out to be too coarse and predictable. Reworked it and I think I got a good elevation/ocean base that I like and players will like. Will post images someday. Need to work on the terrain/biomes and streams and lakes and craaaaaap.
You may have conquered my worlds, but I destroyed them!

Offline Naed

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2015, 06:40:22 am »
Don't get too held up on Biome's. That a place mine craft missed the mark.

Biomes should not be set in stone. The logic that goes into it should simply be elevation, humidity, water table, terrain.

With those metrics the types of plants that should be seeded, and their density can be calculated. Different looking terrain as a whole is not all that appealing, at least I have yet to see it done well.

Offline Mongo

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #24 on: May 07, 2015, 09:14:58 am »
I gotta agree with Naed, I'd rather see a "biome" be dynamic based on the environment rather than an area specifically hardcoded to be different.

The problem here though is replicating the conditions under which a "biome" exists. We don't have air currents, humidity, great mountain ranges, an equator .. so .. I dunno.

I guess you could simulate some of that stuff. Equator is easy enough, take the middle of the world (vertically) and have it be a high base temperature and the top/bottom of the world be a low base temperature.

What are biomes used for though, specific monster spawns?
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Offline Mickey Kudlo

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #25 on: May 07, 2015, 10:53:28 am »
Yeah, figuring out realistic biomes is difficult and requires a real simulation of a sort. For the most part, I will use 3 things to determine a biome: elevation, latitude and freakin' randomness.
- Tropical biomes will be low altitude, mid latitude.
- Desert/hot will be low latitude
- Artic/cold will be high latitude
- Mountain will be high altitude
- Coniferous forest, middle to high altitude, middle to high latitude
- Decidiuos forest, low to middle altitude, low to middle latitude
- Swamp, low altitude, middle latitude

Something like that. It doesn't even need to be that realistic.

Biomes/terrain are used to determine plants, animals, monsters and resources available in an area.
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Offline Greatest

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #26 on: May 07, 2015, 04:03:14 pm »
I think the forests are backwards...I live in a lowerish latitude(mid/southern atlantic), low altitude(very near sea level, maybe a foot above), and all of the forest area near me is coniferous.  on the other hand when you think about all the crazy people who go to see leaves change colors, they usually go to more northern areas(vermont).

also I feel I have to ask since you mentioned oceans and rivers, will there be both fresh and salt water?  I really dislike the idea, but could see how it could add to your biome feel...
why does Fox keep cancelling good shows?

Offline hazze

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #27 on: May 07, 2015, 10:46:01 pm »
if we're going for realistic biome feel, do waterways work? i'd love to be able to live downstream, pour tons of dirt, coal, and garbage into a stream and make plants die further downstream

Offline Sacrifice

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #28 on: May 08, 2015, 11:59:14 am »
also I feel I have to ask since you mentioned oceans and rivers, will there be both fresh and salt water?  I really dislike the idea, but could see how it could add to your biome feel...

But think of all the fishing possibilities. I'm not even joking, I like fishing.

Make fishing a mini game....

Offline Mickey Kudlo

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #29 on: May 08, 2015, 01:02:00 pm »
I haven't really thought about fresh versus salt water. I am already coding shallow, medium and deep ocean biomes which would have different sea/salt water fish. Land biomes could have fresh water fish like trout, bass, yummy loken, etc.

I love the fishing mini game idea :)

I am going for "virtual" realism, heh. Don't wanna get too crazy cuz then I would spend way too much time on biomes. Yeah, forests really have both conifers and broad leafs pretty mixed in throughout the real world but for our purposes, it is nice to separate for variety.
You may have conquered my worlds, but I destroyed them!

Offline Sacrifice

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #30 on: May 08, 2015, 01:44:37 pm »
If you made a fishing minigame i would probably spend 80% of my time doing that. (just saying)

Offline Greatest

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #31 on: May 08, 2015, 07:04:52 pm »
minigame sounds fun, but could be time consuming for something that doesn't need to take a lot of time.  also wouldn't adding the minigame mean skill has no part in fishing?
why does Fox keep cancelling good shows?

Offline Sacrifice

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #32 on: May 09, 2015, 11:26:07 am »
minigame sounds fun, but could be time consuming for something that doesn't need to take a lot of time.  also wouldn't adding the minigame mean skill has no part in fishing?

Yes it would be time consuming, but if the idea is there for it he could start it now and implement it later (if he wants to).

As far as it removing skill points from fishing from the game, no not necessarily it really depends on how the fishing minigame is implemented as there are so many options.

If the fishing minigame were something like this where A was maybe a button you click or direction keys etc.

Fishing takes on a form of combat, whereby the player must reduce a target fish's HP to 0. Cast the lure into the water where an underwater shadow is visible and press A when the lure goes under. As A is held down, the tension on the line increases. If the max tension is reached, the line will snap and the fish escape. Tension can be relieved by letting go of A. Often the fish will struggle and the player must move the analogue pad in the direction indicated by arrows, in order to slow the increase of tension.

The way this game makes fishing a skill is that the more you fish and the more the skill raises, the faster the fishing "HP" goes down while holding the button.

Offline Greatest

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #33 on: May 09, 2015, 06:07:38 pm »
so you want fishing in a game to be harder than fishing for real?

again I like the idea of minigames, but to make something time consuming just because you can doesn't mean you should.  if he plans to add 'work' to fishing I think it would be too much.  if you can make a bronze pick in about 2 mins should it really take longer than 30 seconds to catch 1 fish?  some things are a lot harder to do than others, and fishing is usually something pretty easy!

I'll also add that fishing is the reason I quit future server, it took 10-15 mins for me to catch 1 fish at ~150 skill.  since fish were the only real source of food* it left me starving quite a bit...

*I know you can eat seeds and ultimas but seeds give 1-2 food and potions for food was silly...
why does Fox keep cancelling good shows?

Offline Sacrifice

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #34 on: May 10, 2015, 01:51:56 pm »
With the way I envisioned it, it wouldn't take more than 15 seconds to catch lower level fish(in the beginning) and the lowest level fish may only take a second to catch once you have trained the skill. Then the only fish that mite take 30 seconds+ to catch a fish would be a trophy fish or maybe some special bigger fish(for fishing armor?) this could go a really long way and I don't want it to be to big of a deal lol.

Offline Greatest

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #35 on: May 10, 2015, 11:34:15 pm »
fishing armor?

I can't see a minigame being that short, but less than a minute to catch a fish seems reasonable...compared to other things.

@Mickey, answer part of Hazze's question!  would be neat if water flowed and we could affect it.  dams levies and dikes would be a fun way to flood out someone you don't like ;D  the pollution thing seems like a bad idea though :-\
why does Fox keep cancelling good shows?

Offline Mongo

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Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #36 on: May 11, 2015, 08:44:16 am »
would be neat if water flowed and we could affect it.  dams levies and dikes would be a fun way to flood out someone you don't like ;D 

That seems like it would be a huge source of server lag, calculating directional flows for every space of water for every tick of the server.
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Offline Sacrifice

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #37 on: May 11, 2015, 09:03:26 am »
fishing armor?

I can't see a minigame being that short, but less than a minute to catch a fish seems reasonable...compared to other things.

As said its only the lower tier of fish that would only take a couple seconds to catch, and that is only after you have leveled up your fishing. Higher tiered fish would be possible to catch when you have lower level fishing, it would just take a lot more time then something your level so to speak.

Offline Sacrifice

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #38 on: May 11, 2015, 09:04:43 am »
Fishing armor...


Offline Mickey Kudlo

Re: World Map Creation
« Reply #39 on: May 11, 2015, 12:40:20 pm »
I got terrains/biomes mostly done and spent some time on streams the past couple of coding sessions. The way V5 does streams, it doesn't deal with elevation or flow. It really is just an extension from a lake or ocean, at the same level, unaffected by elevation.
So I been researching how to make it more flowing and it not quite working out, heh. I need to rethink the look of it. I was lowering the elevation and making channels but it gets messed up when going downhill. Gonna spend a little more time on it then will give up for now and leave it for later.
And there are ways to optimize the flow of water. The system doesn't need to check every tick but only when some elevation or water location has changed. Making bigger worlds means I need to only process what needs to be processed. In V1/V2 it would run through everything all at once and give lag spikes at times. But I figured out a way to reduce the lag and spread the processing out over time. Threading is a way to do it too but that has data lock issues that can create even worse lag spikes or full on crashes.

The fishing mini-game would be a combo of fishing skill and action.
- skill and randomness determines what size fish you hook
- use arrow keys to reel and move rod around
- your skill and fish difficulty determines how easy/hard the fish is to catch, like some one with low skill needs to let the reel out more to avoid line break where someone with higher skill just reels the fish in non-stop unless of course the fish is big and has high difficulty.

A hunting mini-game with a bow/xbow/throw weapon could have a targeting window that you need to set to execute, or something.

A mining mini-game would be an unearthed grave! That pops up like a circus game and you have to wallop the zombie where ever it pops its head, heh.

You may have conquered my worlds, but I destroyed them!

 

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